Let's just say that the former is most certainly not the latter. Right.
I went to Redeemer Pres. yesterday. So that happened. I made it to church about ten minutes late, which I thought was a Bad Thing. I needn't have worried. As I got off the subway, I realized I didn't know exactly where I was going, only that Redeemer meets somewhere at Hunter College. Then I realized that the two dozen nicely dressed people leaving the subway with me were almost certainly headed the same place, so I just followed them. Up to 25% of the congregation arrived after I did, some of them up to 20 minutes late. Now granted, exerting rigid control over commute duration is almost impossible on the subway, but that's a bit much, I thought. I couldn't tell if people were okay with it because it's New York, and getting around is tough, or because they were so casual about the whole thing that they didn't care. That's the adjective I'd use to describe the whole service: casual.
Tim Keller, the senior pastor, wasn't there. Apparently he's on sabbatical or something for the summer. The sermon was delivered by one John Lin, a young, Chinese-American pastor whose association with Redeemer was not immediately discernable to me (I still don't know the specifics of the relationship). As he is fairly obviously new to the preaching thing, I was willing to overlook the fact that he took about 10 minutes of introduction before touching on the text. But the fact that he only alluded one other passage of Scripture (without references, I might add) but quoted The New York Times, The Shawshank Redemption, The Silmarillion, and academic psychologist Kenneth J. Gergen of Swarthmore College was a little harder to swallow. I want to hear about Bread, Water, Light, and Blood, not the "social saturation of the self". Oh, and for the record, having people who are obviously wannabe professional actors read your Scripture selection does not, I repeat, does not win you any points. Refined and mellow is not the vibe we're looking for here.
Still, I'm not going to make any decisions until I hear Keller preach. That seems only fair. But as I was sitting there, I was thinking that if this is what passes for solid teaching in New York City, all of a sudden the Cathedral of St. John the Divine isn't looking all that bad. Sure, the preaching will be awful, but they've got liturgy and architecture, which I understand even if they don't. This will take some thinking through.
I do have other options. Redeemer has a daughter church on Riverside Drive which is a lot more conveniently located than Redeemer proper. They also have a West Side worship service here. So we'll spend some time looking around. And if I do decide to stick with the PCA, I can still attend Vespers at the Cathedral, plus Eucharist every morning.
Still, as big a city as New York is, you'd think that there would not only be solid preaching but options to choose from. As it is, I'm making the best of a bad situation, not moving from strength to strength. So it goes, I guess.
Posted by ryan at August 23, 2004 11:09 AM | TrackBackMy friend's dad, Charlie Drew, pastors the Riverside Drive church. His son Allen got married a couple weekends ago and met him there. I've only heard him give that marriage sermon, but it was pretty good, and Charlie and his wife seem really cool. If that helps at all.
Posted by: josh at August 23, 2004 11:29 AMIf you want some Messianic-Jewish Theonomistic Fun-ness you could also hitup Steve Schlissel's church in Brooklyn.
Tell him I said hi.
Posted by: JosiahQ at August 23, 2004 01:48 PMThe whole issue of solid preaching and where it's place is in a city's oft-outreach focused churches has been one for constant conversation since I moved to Chicago this past year, where the churches (at least the PCA ones) often seem to lack it. Let me know if you want to talk about it - or commiserate. Harmony and I have hashed out several theories on why it might be the case. lately I keep wondering if I was spoiled by the churches I grew up in? But do hold out for Keller. I attended Redeemer for a summer ('00) and he can be excellent.
Posted by: mia at August 24, 2004 03:15 PMYeah man, Pastor Murphy (the one at the URC-ish church plant) is great.
I'd also recommend waiting to hear Keller. Most everything I've heard about him as been good.
Posted by: nick at August 24, 2004 04:34 PMalso if you ever get the chance to go to astoria, queens, check out astoria community church (www.astoriachurch.org). it meets in a synagogue. david ellis is the pastor there and is excellent and quite personable. the assistant pastor is brazilian and a solid preacher, too. it's much smaller and is frequented by some covenant grads.
but tim keller is one of the best preachers i've ever heard, whether on tape or live. he puts everything in a way you've never before thought of and sticks to the scriptures.
Posted by: laura at August 24, 2004 08:09 PMKeller is incredible & brillant, and to stay sharp, he takes summers off now. And preaches during the school year. You can get listen to some of his messages in the samples section in the sermon store at the Redeemer website www.redeemer.com
Posted by: djchuang at January 27, 2005 10:15 PM